1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,360 But let's go ahead and get started. So this is our second 2 00:00:03,390 --> 00:00:08,550 textbook equity panel as part Rod Library's programming for 3 00:00:08,580 --> 00:00:13,290 Open Access Week, International Open Access week. So this panel 4 00:00:13,290 --> 00:00:17,160 will focus on creating three openly licensed textbooks. And 5 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:21,210 we have a couple of faculty who have or are doing just that. I'm 6 00:00:21,210 --> 00:00:25,350 Anne Marie Gruber, librarian, here, my part of my focus is 7 00:00:25,350 --> 00:00:28,950 textbook equity work camp-wide. So supporting that, and we'll 8 00:00:28,950 --> 00:00:32,160 talk a little bit here about what that is. I'll give some 9 00:00:32,160 --> 00:00:34,920 introductory remarks and then turn it over to our panelists to 10 00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:38,010 introduce themselves. And I'll pose some questions to them for 11 00:00:38,010 --> 00:00:41,940 our conversation. And we should have ample time at the end for 12 00:00:41,940 --> 00:00:46,290 questions from the audience as well. So what is textbook 13 00:00:46,290 --> 00:00:50,910 equity? You may hear the phrase textbook affordability that 14 00:00:50,910 --> 00:00:55,170 other campuses use or open educational resources, sometimes 15 00:00:55,200 --> 00:01:00,270 referred to by the acronym OER. We talk about textbook equity 16 00:01:00,270 --> 00:01:04,200 here, that's very intentional. This is the campus wide 17 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:08,640 initiative aiming to ensure that all UNI students have access to 18 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:12,210 high quality course materials that are affordable, accessible, 19 00:01:12,210 --> 00:01:15,990 and inclusive. That includes a lot of different sorts of 20 00:01:16,020 --> 00:01:18,870 flavors of resources, some of which are affordable to 21 00:01:18,870 --> 00:01:23,070 students, some of which are 100% free to students. For this 22 00:01:23,070 --> 00:01:26,400 particular panel, we're going to focus on open educational 23 00:01:26,400 --> 00:01:29,700 resources. So the orange there, which are resources that are 24 00:01:29,730 --> 00:01:35,010 free, 100% free to students and to everyone, and also licensed 25 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:41,190 or reduce modification, download, saving remixing a 26 00:01:41,190 --> 00:01:47,160 variety of things. So why is this important? Let me move 27 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:51,630 around a little zoom window here to see see everything. So this 28 00:01:51,630 --> 00:01:55,830 is important because we know from survey research conducted 29 00:01:55,830 --> 00:02:01,230 at UNI that at least in spring 2021, about half of our students 30 00:02:01,230 --> 00:02:05,370 reported not purchasing required textbooks. So we have close to 31 00:02:05,370 --> 00:02:08,760 700 students participate in that survey ranging from first year 32 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:12,840 students all the way to graduate students. So faculty should 33 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:15,900 really assume that about half your students don't have the 34 00:02:15,900 --> 00:02:21,060 textbook. We also know from our own students that they report 35 00:02:21,060 --> 00:02:24,960 some challenges academically that can be caused at least in 36 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:29,010 part by in textbook access problems. So you see the stats 37 00:02:29,010 --> 00:02:32,550 there about how much students may report changing sections of 38 00:02:32,550 --> 00:02:35,430 a course or avoiding a certain section or course altogether. 39 00:02:35,670 --> 00:02:38,910 Because of textbook costs, earning poor failing grades, of 40 00:02:38,910 --> 00:02:41,400 course, there can be lots of reasons why a student might not 41 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:45,510 do well. But this in this survey students told us that textbook 42 00:02:45,510 --> 00:02:49,650 costs are one of the key factors. Dropping in course, 43 00:02:49,650 --> 00:02:52,680 taking fewer courses, almost one in five of our students on the 44 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:56,850 survey, I talked with a student this semester, for example, who 45 00:02:56,880 --> 00:03:00,600 has a course required for their major, they've now dropped in 46 00:03:00,630 --> 00:03:03,930 two semesters in a row because the same textbook that is out of 47 00:03:03,930 --> 00:03:07,530 their price range keeps being required in that particular 48 00:03:07,530 --> 00:03:09,510 course. So they don't know what they're going to do because they 49 00:03:09,510 --> 00:03:12,360 can't afford the text this semester. They couldn't afford 50 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:16,290 it last semester. And the future semesters use the same text, 51 00:03:16,290 --> 00:03:19,560 that's a class they need to graduate and that's too steep a 52 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:23,790 barrier for them. We also use the textbook equity language 53 00:03:23,790 --> 00:03:27,630 very intentionally because we know that access barriers in 54 00:03:27,630 --> 00:03:33,240 terms of course, materials don't impact all students equally. So 55 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,720 we know from research conducted beyond UNI, that students in the 56 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:40,530 US who face the most barriers in terms of access to course 57 00:03:40,530 --> 00:03:45,630 materials, and often other basic needs. Food insecurity, housing 58 00:03:45,630 --> 00:03:51,210 insecurity, tend to be non white, tend to be more likely to 59 00:03:51,210 --> 00:03:55,290 be Pell eligible. So one sort of measure of financial need 60 00:03:55,890 --> 00:03:59,490 international students and who are part time students. So in 61 00:03:59,490 --> 00:04:02,340 some ways, those are students that we are we are recruiting, 62 00:04:02,370 --> 00:04:05,910 and we're trying to raise enrollment. So those are things 63 00:04:05,910 --> 00:04:11,070 we need to be thinking about. We also know that when faculty make 64 00:04:11,070 --> 00:04:14,310 a decision within their academic freedom to transition to free 65 00:04:14,310 --> 00:04:18,750 course materials. We know from at least one meta analysis that 66 00:04:18,930 --> 00:04:23,490 course withdrawals can decline pretty significantly. So those 67 00:04:23,490 --> 00:04:26,790 students who face those most barriers are benefited the most. 68 00:04:27,270 --> 00:04:29,640 But all students can benefit from that. So I wanted to 69 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:33,060 provide a little context for those of you who might be newer 70 00:04:33,060 --> 00:04:39,540 to textbook equity. So I have Professor Nikki Harken and Dr. 71 00:04:39,540 --> 00:04:43,200 Randall Harlow, who will serve on our panel today. I've 72 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:46,710 included each of their textbooks here, when it's finished. One is 73 00:04:46,710 --> 00:04:50,490 in progress. And I would love for them to each introduce 74 00:04:50,490 --> 00:04:54,390 themselves. Tell us about you and your department, and which 75 00:04:54,390 --> 00:04:58,500 is the course that you created an open license textbook to in 76 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,410 and was it something that you you're creating from scratch or 77 00:05:01,410 --> 00:05:03,210 a remix of existing material. 78 00:05:06,660 --> 00:05:10,200 So I'm Nikki Harken and I'm from the Department of Communication 79 00:05:10,230 --> 00:05:13,440 and Media, which is, of course based in Lang Hall. And one of 80 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:16,260 the courses I teach is Cornerstone, which is used to 81 00:05:16,260 --> 00:05:18,390 take the place of Oral Communication and College 82 00:05:18,390 --> 00:05:22,320 Writing and Research. It's a two semester sequence course, for 83 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:26,130 freshmen only. You have two, it's embedded with peer mentors, 84 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:29,370 and also a lot of other information from on campus, we 85 00:05:29,370 --> 00:05:32,370 have financial aid come and do things. We work closely with 86 00:05:32,370 --> 00:05:35,520 advising, for instance, on Monday, my Cornerstone class, I 87 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:38,310 spent half of it, I'm talking through the registration process 88 00:05:38,310 --> 00:05:41,340 with freshmen, because as freshmen when they come in, 89 00:05:41,370 --> 00:05:45,420 they've never done it. They sat beside usually a peer mentor or 90 00:05:45,420 --> 00:05:48,000 an orientation staff in the summer, they don't actually know 91 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,270 how that process works or what it looks like. So we, we really 92 00:05:51,300 --> 00:05:54,510 try to help students merge into the university in a variety of 93 00:05:54,510 --> 00:06:00,180 ways. So I had been using an OER and open educational resource 94 00:06:00,180 --> 00:06:04,440 for I don't know, probably three years, before we decided to do 95 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:07,440 this mashup. One of the challenges of Cornerstone is 96 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:11,340 because it takes the place of those two courses, we usually 97 00:06:11,340 --> 00:06:15,480 ended up with two pretty big textbooks, and usually ended up 98 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,480 costing students upwards of $200. And that was for the 99 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:21,600 entire year, so you didn't feel terrible about it. But you also 100 00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:24,630 knew that that was definitely a barrier because they didn't need 101 00:06:24,630 --> 00:06:28,020 them right away, because the course content is integrated. So 102 00:06:28,020 --> 00:06:30,120 while we're doing narrative speaking, we're also doing 103 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:33,870 narrative writing. And so they have to have those resources at 104 00:06:33,870 --> 00:06:39,180 once. So I moved to using an OER for the oral comm portion of 105 00:06:39,180 --> 00:06:43,110 that text, because found in a review of I can't remember what 106 00:06:43,110 --> 00:06:45,390 it is from University of Minnesota, Communication in the 107 00:06:45,390 --> 00:06:48,630 Real World, is the text from the University of Minnesota that is 108 00:06:48,630 --> 00:06:52,950 an OER, served pretty well for oral comm and had most of the 109 00:06:52,950 --> 00:06:55,830 content in there. And anything that was missing, I found it 110 00:06:55,830 --> 00:07:00,270 pretty easy to supplement whatever we needed. And so Deb 111 00:07:00,270 --> 00:07:02,280 Young, who is from the Department of Languages, and 112 00:07:02,280 --> 00:07:05,940 literature's and I had a nice conversation about how we wish 113 00:07:05,940 --> 00:07:09,300 we could have one source for students, it's fairly easy, and 114 00:07:09,300 --> 00:07:11,580 that we would also love to integrate other university 115 00:07:11,580 --> 00:07:16,080 resources into that for our students. And so we contacted 116 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:20,850 Anne Marie and really worked with her to get this going. And 117 00:07:20,850 --> 00:07:25,200 one of the reasons that, I would say, well, it's so it's a mix of 118 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:28,200 existing materials, trying to answer your questions. But one 119 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:32,700 of the reasons that was important to me, it was three 120 00:07:32,700 --> 00:07:36,450 years ago, but it even became moreso. We are a middle class 121 00:07:36,450 --> 00:07:38,700 family, and we have five children, we're a blended 122 00:07:38,700 --> 00:07:44,790 family, all in college. And that's a lot. And we are because 123 00:07:44,790 --> 00:07:47,490 of our middle class nature, unable to help our children pay 124 00:07:47,490 --> 00:07:51,870 for college, that just is a very rude reality. In a couple of 125 00:07:51,870 --> 00:07:55,800 weeks ago, well actually in August, my son goes to Wartburg. 126 00:07:56,220 --> 00:07:59,670 And I was reminded of this and became even more passionate 127 00:07:59,670 --> 00:08:04,470 about it because I went to go cosign for him for his student 128 00:08:04,470 --> 00:08:08,370 loan, obviously, to go to Wartburg, and I had to have a 129 00:08:08,370 --> 00:08:12,090 cosigner. Because I don't make enough even if I've been in 130 00:08:12,090 --> 00:08:16,320 public education for 20 years, I don't make enough to cosign for 131 00:08:16,320 --> 00:08:21,060 my own child's school loan. So I had to have my parents, a 46 132 00:08:21,090 --> 00:08:24,990 year old woman, cosign for me, and I just, it really got me 133 00:08:24,990 --> 00:08:29,010 thinking about how even as a middle aged person, who's had a 134 00:08:29,010 --> 00:08:35,370 steady job for 20 years is built a career here that someone who 135 00:08:35,370 --> 00:08:41,130 didn't have that has even less than me. And so in a way being 136 00:08:41,130 --> 00:08:45,210 able to take off if if all of us didn't, OERs right. So I think 137 00:08:45,210 --> 00:08:49,890 about my own kids, they probably spend at least $500 a semester 138 00:08:49,890 --> 00:08:53,130 on text, right? I would guess. So in my family, that's going to 139 00:08:53,130 --> 00:08:57,600 save $2,500 every semester. So it doesn't take long for that to 140 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:00,480 add up. And I just started thinking about how I can do this 141 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:03,960 very small, because I can't control tuition. None of us can 142 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:06,960 control tuition, we can through our coping, but otherwise, 143 00:09:06,990 --> 00:09:09,390 right? I don't need to make those decisions. So this is one 144 00:09:09,390 --> 00:09:13,320 way to really try to help students and families manage at 145 00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:16,530 least some costs of college. So 146 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:21,340 That's sort of a personal experience. Isn't it? So Randall 147 00:09:21,340 --> 00:09:24,280 how about you. What's the course or course that is your case and 148 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:25,540 is it an original or a [inaudible]? 149 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,830 Yeah, so we're putting together an OER for the core music, 150 00:09:30,130 --> 00:09:34,360 undergraduate strings. And music majors are a variety of types, 151 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:37,930 some kind of study performance, come to study, education, teach 152 00:09:37,930 --> 00:09:41,350 music, others decide on music technology, and from all of 153 00:09:41,350 --> 00:09:43,990 these degree tracks, they all go through these fourth semester 154 00:09:43,990 --> 00:09:47,260 core theory classes, where they learn about basically how music 155 00:09:47,260 --> 00:09:51,970 works called Music Theory and and develop skills, musicianship 156 00:09:51,970 --> 00:09:54,370 skills, so they have to sing they have to listen to stuff and 157 00:09:54,370 --> 00:09:58,480 write it down and just develop it. And so for this, we've been 158 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:01,840 using two textbooks. A written textbook for music theory, and 159 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:05,590 one that helps develop singing skills, which cost about $200, 160 00:10:06,190 --> 00:10:10,510 which is in total, which is, of course for sports semesters. 161 00:10:10,900 --> 00:10:14,200 But, you know, I mean, we want to save students money. And to 162 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:17,770 be frank, I can't speak for all other areas. But in music theory 163 00:10:17,770 --> 00:10:21,280 and musicianship, these textbooks are, it's basically a 164 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:24,850 lazy rush for professors. I mean, stuff, we could walk into 165 00:10:24,850 --> 00:10:28,750 the class and teach it do. It just provide some written things 166 00:10:28,750 --> 00:10:31,600 for some introduction. So we could let students read ahead of 167 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:34,810 time, we could spend more of our time building the kind of 168 00:10:34,810 --> 00:10:38,170 drilling the concepts and skills and it's just saves time and 169 00:10:38,170 --> 00:10:41,860 energy. So when the opportunity arose for us to actually make 170 00:10:41,860 --> 00:10:45,970 our own materials, so why not just save students money. And 171 00:10:45,970 --> 00:10:47,440 for reasons, we'll get to probably in some other 172 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:49,660 questions, it'd be more beneficial for our program, 173 00:10:49,870 --> 00:10:53,290 existing textbooks as they stand. So for the most part, 174 00:10:53,290 --> 00:10:56,620 we're making materials from scratch. But we're also using 175 00:10:56,620 --> 00:10:59,830 some materials that we've developed over the years. So we 176 00:10:59,830 --> 00:11:02,500 are kind of on our way. And this gave us a reason to really make 177 00:11:02,500 --> 00:11:02,950 it up. 178 00:11:03,740 --> 00:11:05,510 I don't know if I'm gonna mention it later. I can mention 179 00:11:05,510 --> 00:11:09,200 it now, that Randall's team is participating in the Regent's 180 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:13,190 OER program which was started last year. That was kind of a 181 00:11:13,190 --> 00:11:17,870 one time thing that the Regent's libraries work together to get a 182 00:11:17,900 --> 00:11:20,510 federal funds through the Iowa Department of Education and 183 00:11:20,510 --> 00:11:25,910 folks to participate in. This is the draft cover that we're 184 00:11:25,940 --> 00:11:36,020 quickly making changes to. Yeah. Right, we're getting there. We 185 00:11:36,020 --> 00:11:39,260 should have some original sheet music that's some original music 186 00:11:39,260 --> 00:11:41,090 that's part of that cover, too, right? 187 00:11:41,510 --> 00:11:45,350 Oh, yeah, maybe, we'll figure out our Photoshop skills. 188 00:11:46,170 --> 00:11:48,570 Right. So that's the idea that will sort of customize that a 189 00:11:48,600 --> 00:11:51,960 bit further. So we worked with the graphic designer to do kind 190 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:56,610 of the basic basic layout, as opposed to the cornerstone one, 191 00:11:56,610 --> 00:12:00,990 which I did, and I don't have graphic design skills. But I 192 00:12:00,990 --> 00:12:04,530 also wanted to include those because you can kind of see 193 00:12:04,530 --> 00:12:08,970 examples, but also I included the estimated cost savings for 194 00:12:08,970 --> 00:12:12,210 each of the courses that we're talking about. So you can see, 195 00:12:12,210 --> 00:12:15,510 like you said that they really do add up pretty, pretty 196 00:12:15,510 --> 00:12:20,160 quickly. So you've touched on this a little bit. But I wonder 197 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:23,640 if you could go into some detail about what motivated you to 198 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:26,910 create a free, openly licensed textbook for your course. 199 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:31,550 Sure. So I think I touched on this quite a bit as far as what 200 00:12:31,550 --> 00:12:34,400 we did. But the thing that I didn't touch on was while we 201 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:37,910 have an integrated nature, we also are highly integrated in 202 00:12:37,910 --> 00:12:40,730 campus. So I talk about advising and registration and all of 203 00:12:40,730 --> 00:12:44,450 these other areas. So because we were able to create our own 204 00:12:44,450 --> 00:12:48,170 textbook, we also integrated that information into the text 205 00:12:48,170 --> 00:12:52,490 itself. So for instance, the new Panther Guide, which came from 206 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:58,010 the Dean of Students Office, I believe, yep. orientations that 207 00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:01,340 yes, it was Joellen. That's another, we're actually able to 208 00:13:01,340 --> 00:13:05,480 put that into our textbook, which has been awesome, because 209 00:13:05,480 --> 00:13:08,540 now, if students have questions about financial aid, there's, 210 00:13:08,660 --> 00:13:11,540 there's a resource within their textbook about financial aid, 211 00:13:11,570 --> 00:13:13,820 there's a resource about the Counseling Center, there's a 212 00:13:13,820 --> 00:13:17,390 resource. And so while they may get this beautiful packet, if 213 00:13:17,390 --> 00:13:21,740 you've seen it, it's purple and beautiful, beautifully done. But 214 00:13:21,740 --> 00:13:24,440 probably in the trash for a lot of students after orientation. 215 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:27,200 When am I going to need this? Why would I save this? So now 216 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,930 they actually have that information within an existing 217 00:13:29,930 --> 00:13:33,620 book. And so we were able to merge together quite a few 218 00:13:33,620 --> 00:13:35,990 different texts, seven, 219 00:13:36,030 --> 00:13:39,180 seven to seven is what it was. 220 00:13:40,170 --> 00:13:43,320 And to create something that was much more holistic, and really 221 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:46,890 represented students' experience throughout the year that they 222 00:13:46,890 --> 00:13:47,670 take Cornerstone. 223 00:13:48,450 --> 00:13:51,750 I'm going to add one thing, which was we didn't do a ton of 224 00:13:51,750 --> 00:13:55,620 customization besides adding that Panther Guide. But I do 225 00:13:55,620 --> 00:13:58,710 remember distinctly an email conversation about you know, 226 00:13:58,710 --> 00:14:02,910 there's an example in one of the chapters of academic integrity 227 00:14:02,910 --> 00:14:06,600 policies, and it linked to some other institutions. And I said, 228 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:09,810 Why don't we link to ours? And so we changed that. So we can 229 00:14:09,810 --> 00:14:12,120 reflect our own policies. And it's right there in the 230 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:14,970 textbook. And so just little things like that at this pace 231 00:14:14,970 --> 00:14:18,180 that we were able to sort of customize. Absolutely. How about 232 00:14:18,180 --> 00:14:20,550 you, Randall? So let's talk about your team's motivation. 233 00:14:20,570 --> 00:14:23,690 Yeah, I mean, in addition to saving money, yeah, I think 234 00:14:23,690 --> 00:14:28,130 there's a convergence of two trends in music over recent 235 00:14:28,130 --> 00:14:32,690 years. And both of which stemmed from an interest in music 236 00:14:32,690 --> 00:14:37,010 programs to have been called decolonized music or to 237 00:14:37,010 --> 00:14:40,250 recognize music in a broader capacity in this country. I 238 00:14:40,250 --> 00:14:43,370 mean, in the Western European music tradition, it's no wonder 239 00:14:43,370 --> 00:14:46,970 that the School of Music, School of Music simply means Western, 240 00:14:46,970 --> 00:14:50,840 traditional western classical art music. But of course, we 241 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:52,760 want to move beyond that. I mean, it took so many 242 00:14:52,760 --> 00:14:55,970 generations for jazz just be recognized in academia. And even 243 00:14:55,970 --> 00:14:59,600 then that's only decades old. Jazz Studies program was 244 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:03,170 actually something and legitimate, so that the facts 245 00:15:03,170 --> 00:15:07,640 are recognizing that Western classical music is but one 246 00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:11,870 strand of what could be music study and valued music and the 247 00:15:11,870 --> 00:15:16,070 music program, I think led to this to in two different ways 248 00:15:16,070 --> 00:15:19,700 one, and that we've noticed over the past 10 years, especially 249 00:15:19,700 --> 00:15:24,140 the past five years, students coming to UNI have had a lower 250 00:15:24,140 --> 00:15:29,450 skill level in Western classical music than have in the past. And 251 00:15:29,450 --> 00:15:32,570 so they've come to UNI with less knowledge than we traditionally 252 00:15:32,570 --> 00:15:37,640 have. And the textbooks that exist, kind of assume a certain 253 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:40,610 level of musical knowledge. So we've been struggling for a few 254 00:15:40,610 --> 00:15:42,770 years with having to catch a number of students up to a 255 00:15:42,770 --> 00:15:44,630 certain level before they can really start this core 256 00:15:44,630 --> 00:15:49,340 curriculum. And so that's one aspect. And two is that we've 257 00:15:49,340 --> 00:15:52,160 had, there have been students over the years who've been 258 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:54,830 really talented musicians, but haven't grown up in the western 259 00:15:54,830 --> 00:15:58,430 classical tradition didn't go to kind of the traditional bands 260 00:15:58,430 --> 00:16:01,940 and choirs high school, but then maybe they're like, for one 261 00:16:01,940 --> 00:16:03,770 student I can think of, I think it was a pianist, a gospel 262 00:16:03,770 --> 00:16:07,010 pianist in his church growing up, he's a great musician, but 263 00:16:07,010 --> 00:16:10,580 didn't know a lot about notation and kind of basics of Western 264 00:16:10,580 --> 00:16:13,100 classical theory, but had a hard time to have students have a 265 00:16:13,100 --> 00:16:16,580 hard time catching up to that degree. But they're already 266 00:16:16,700 --> 00:16:19,130 really excellent musicians, but they don't have the knowledge to 267 00:16:19,130 --> 00:16:22,310 kind of follow the curriculum as it stands with the existing 268 00:16:22,340 --> 00:16:26,780 textbooks. So this gave us a chance to create our own our own 269 00:16:26,810 --> 00:16:29,810 material, basically, that could really be tailored to the level 270 00:16:29,810 --> 00:16:33,710 of students that we're seeing coming to UNI. And at the same 271 00:16:33,710 --> 00:16:36,470 time, we're developing, they're talking about building a new 272 00:16:36,470 --> 00:16:39,860 curriculum that is a little bit more open and kind of 273 00:16:39,890 --> 00:16:42,260 decolonizes music theory curriculum in a sense. 274 00:16:43,220 --> 00:16:46,340 [Inaudible], it's a whole exploring musical fluency and a 275 00:16:46,340 --> 00:16:49,460 new way that's less sort of Western European art and music 276 00:16:49,460 --> 00:16:52,820 centric. And so while that curriculum development is a few 277 00:16:52,820 --> 00:16:55,790 years away yet, having this textbook having this sort of 278 00:16:55,790 --> 00:17:00,020 modularity and sort of the very tightly focused modules of this, 279 00:17:00,050 --> 00:17:02,270 I think, allow us to kind of restructure that to use it for 280 00:17:02,270 --> 00:17:05,630 our current use, and to restructure it as our curriculum 281 00:17:05,630 --> 00:17:06,980 changes. So it gives us that flexion. 282 00:17:08,810 --> 00:17:11,810 And you heard some of the reason why we call this textbook 283 00:17:11,810 --> 00:17:16,130 equity, in most most conversations, right? So far, 284 00:17:16,130 --> 00:17:19,280 what's been the biggest challenges or surprises that 285 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:20,240 your team has faced? 286 00:17:21,650 --> 00:17:27,830 I would say that our, our text is really long, really, really 287 00:17:27,830 --> 00:17:32,540 long. It's too long. But we really don't want to say threw 288 00:17:32,540 --> 00:17:34,940 it together but kind of threw it together a little bit, once we 289 00:17:34,940 --> 00:17:37,280 figured out that we could do this and we could merge several 290 00:17:38,090 --> 00:17:41,810 different textbooks. And so I would say that's the bigger 291 00:17:41,810 --> 00:17:45,770 challenge is just when students open it, they see it's like 400 292 00:17:45,770 --> 00:17:52,880 pages, however long. It's long. So they see that initially, and 293 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:56,360 are really turned off by that without thinking like no, no, 294 00:17:56,630 --> 00:18:00,680 right? Each day, right? We're gonna read 10 to 15 pages, and 295 00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:04,280 this is for a full year. And so we had to come up with some 296 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:08,480 better way of presenting that textbook to students so that 297 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:11,000 it's not all at once. I'm not sure what that is going to be. 298 00:18:11,720 --> 00:18:15,830 But the exciting thing is that there are two other that I know 299 00:18:15,830 --> 00:18:19,340 of Cornerstone folks using this text. And so now we kind of have 300 00:18:19,340 --> 00:18:22,490 a core team of people that I think will will sit down and 301 00:18:22,490 --> 00:18:26,180 say, Okay, what are the really necessary parts of this chapter 302 00:18:26,180 --> 00:18:30,440 that we want? What can we throw out? Because I would absolutely 303 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:34,400 echo what Randall said in that, you know, a lot of our com 304 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,820 textbooks, give all these examples, right? And all these 305 00:18:37,820 --> 00:18:40,040 sort of flowery things like, well, that's what we do in 306 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:43,640 class, I need you to just give them a definition of this thing. 307 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:48,050 And then let me teach it instead of needing, you know, 10 pages 308 00:18:48,050 --> 00:18:52,250 to talk about that thing. So I'd say that that is our biggest 309 00:18:52,250 --> 00:18:56,690 challenge is the length and the delivery of that. And I think 310 00:18:56,690 --> 00:18:59,810 we'll get the kinks worked out on that, for sure. And time. 311 00:18:59,810 --> 00:19:01,910 Should we talk about format here? Or do you want to talk 312 00:19:01,910 --> 00:19:05,420 about that later? You can. Yeah, we can talk. So right now it's a 313 00:19:05,450 --> 00:19:11,540 it's a PDF. And we provided it in in Google doc form. And PDFs 314 00:19:11,570 --> 00:19:15,770 hold the full text of one PDF, but also separate chapter PDFs 315 00:19:15,770 --> 00:19:19,430 so that students can use it how they like, PDFs are not 316 00:19:19,430 --> 00:19:22,250 necessarily ideal from an accessibility standpoint, even 317 00:19:22,250 --> 00:19:27,770 though we've remediated as much as we can. But the next step 318 00:19:27,770 --> 00:19:31,220 probably will be put it in an ebook authoring software. So we 319 00:19:31,220 --> 00:19:35,480 have the software manifold as part of a pilot through UNI as 320 00:19:35,510 --> 00:19:39,680 membership in the Open Education Network. So that lets us create 321 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:44,390 some nicely formatted ebooks. So we have that as a pilot through 322 00:19:44,390 --> 00:19:47,750 spring of 2024. And so I'm hopeful that the Cornerstone 323 00:19:47,750 --> 00:19:51,140 project will really be our first kind of pilot projects in that 324 00:19:51,140 --> 00:19:54,920 manifold software and it makes for a really nice sort of user 325 00:19:54,920 --> 00:20:00,380 experience of reading an ebook and not seeing all however many 326 00:20:00,380 --> 00:20:05,990 pages all at once, and making sure that it's navigable and you 327 00:20:05,990 --> 00:20:09,290 know, has that nice, that nice navigation. And it's really 328 00:20:09,290 --> 00:20:12,890 great on accessibility too. So that's kind of our step in terms 329 00:20:12,890 --> 00:20:15,680 of format, which I think will help us address it. 330 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,670 One way also for students who wanted to print or who do you 331 00:20:19,670 --> 00:20:23,600 want to print, I know I have, I went and had it printed a copy 332 00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:26,120 works just sort of knew how much the whole thing would cost and 333 00:20:26,120 --> 00:20:28,580 put tabs in and it showed them that I probably shouldn't have 334 00:20:28,580 --> 00:20:34,850 done it. So you know, it's only $70, which is still incredibly 335 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:39,050 less expensive than these seven books would have been self. 336 00:20:41,790 --> 00:20:45,240 Things challenge, I'd say it's just the nature of the material, 337 00:20:45,270 --> 00:20:50,670 because it integrates into a sheet music, integrates aural 338 00:20:50,910 --> 00:20:57,150 recordings and, and tutorials on theoretical topics, which also 339 00:20:57,150 --> 00:20:59,310 integrate kind of sheet music notation. There's a lot of 340 00:20:59,310 --> 00:21:03,210 logistics involved with kind of formatting of files and creation 341 00:21:03,210 --> 00:21:06,390 of content. And especially with our team of four members of our 342 00:21:06,390 --> 00:21:08,730 team, we all kind of have different strengths in that 343 00:21:08,730 --> 00:21:11,640 degree. So really coordinating how who does what and how we do 344 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:14,910 this. It's not as easy as the [inaudible] content one thing, 345 00:21:14,910 --> 00:21:17,760 okay, I'll do this chapter, you do this chapter. But for 346 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:20,610 instance, one member of our team is a composer. And he's really 347 00:21:20,610 --> 00:21:23,610 fluent on the software that does engraved in type of music. So 348 00:21:23,970 --> 00:21:26,820 that's that, but then he relies on getting information from our 349 00:21:26,820 --> 00:21:29,580 other. One of the other members of the team who actually taught 350 00:21:29,580 --> 00:21:32,760 this particular class has some material that she's created over 351 00:21:32,760 --> 00:21:34,710 a number of semesters. So that's kind of linking all that 352 00:21:34,710 --> 00:21:38,790 together, I think it's been a challenge. What surprised us, 353 00:21:38,820 --> 00:21:43,290 what surprised me is how little it's out there in existing OERs 354 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,010 that relate to what we're doing. There are existing ones, it's a 355 00:21:47,010 --> 00:21:49,080 new one set and ready pointed out that are coming out 356 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:53,220 currently, which, but for the most part, they're either more 357 00:21:53,310 --> 00:21:57,270 their too elementary, or their too focused. None of them really 358 00:21:57,270 --> 00:22:00,720 encapsulate the entire kind of undergraduate core music 359 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:03,060 curriculum, which is pretty much the same in every school of 360 00:22:03,060 --> 00:22:07,800 music anywhere in the country. And none of them integrate kind 361 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:11,400 of music, fluency and skills with music knowledge in the way 362 00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:15,900 that we're trying to do to be more equitable or more 363 00:22:15,900 --> 00:22:18,060 accessible for students from non tradition. 364 00:22:20,130 --> 00:22:24,360 And I'll mention for Randall's team for their projects. That in 365 00:22:24,360 --> 00:22:29,070 terms of format will actually be a nicely formatted ebook, using 366 00:22:29,070 --> 00:22:31,890 Pressbooks, the software Pressbooks, through our 367 00:22:31,890 --> 00:22:35,010 partnership with Iowa State. Both Iowa and Iowa State have 368 00:22:35,310 --> 00:22:38,760 ebook offering software for openly licensed courses, that's 369 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:41,970 called textbooks. And so we're, as part of that Regent's 370 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:45,420 collaboration were using both their software and their 371 00:22:45,420 --> 00:22:46,110 expertise. 372 00:22:46,260 --> 00:22:48,750 That's a central part of integrating this media as well. 373 00:22:48,810 --> 00:22:51,510 So we can read something, click on something hear a sound click 374 00:22:51,510 --> 00:22:54,120 on this, it'd be good to go right to the exercise has 375 00:22:54,120 --> 00:22:54,960 mentioned how we're doing. 376 00:22:57,690 --> 00:23:01,200 Yeah, we're lucky to have that sort of partnership, at least 377 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:04,830 for those particular grant programs. If you've already 378 00:23:04,830 --> 00:23:07,650 piloted or implemented your book, then of course, how have 379 00:23:07,650 --> 00:23:09,750 your students responded? Mine have 380 00:23:09,690 --> 00:23:11,970 responded really well, other than the length the length 381 00:23:11,970 --> 00:23:17,100 really threw them for a loop and and how to access it. I think, 382 00:23:17,430 --> 00:23:21,660 looking back, I gave them too many routes as freshmen, you 383 00:23:21,660 --> 00:23:23,820 know, oh, you can get it this way, or I'll share this Google 384 00:23:23,820 --> 00:23:26,610 folder with you. I'll share it on either, I'll send it to you 385 00:23:26,610 --> 00:23:29,700 this way. And I think they're like, Oh, which way is the right 386 00:23:29,700 --> 00:23:32,610 way? So I think that's, that's on me, I should have simplified 387 00:23:32,610 --> 00:23:36,630 it and said here's where you can find it. So the navigation of 388 00:23:36,690 --> 00:23:40,380 where to find it probably has been the more difficult thing 389 00:23:40,380 --> 00:23:45,060 for students. As far as them not having to buy a text, they're so 390 00:23:45,570 --> 00:23:50,790 outwardly thankful, outwardly thankful. It when I tell them, 391 00:23:51,030 --> 00:23:54,030 you know that we're trying to make this course a zero cost 392 00:23:54,030 --> 00:23:58,410 course, other than tuition, they're so outright thankful 393 00:23:59,430 --> 00:24:02,070 that it sometimes makes me a little emotional, to be very 394 00:24:02,070 --> 00:24:06,180 honest. Because when I went to college 20 years ago, I never 395 00:24:06,180 --> 00:24:10,140 thought about textbooks as being a barrier for me, and I was a 396 00:24:10,140 --> 00:24:16,560 Pell Grant student. It came from a fairly poor family and so not 397 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,860 even thinking about that 20 years ago, and how that's now 398 00:24:19,860 --> 00:24:24,030 impacting our more middle class students. The barrier is, is 399 00:24:24,030 --> 00:24:27,450 very disheartening and so they're just yes have been so 400 00:24:27,450 --> 00:24:32,730 thankful and gracious and but yes, the navigation, you know, 401 00:24:32,730 --> 00:24:35,460 we often talk about our students as being very tech savvy, but 402 00:24:35,460 --> 00:24:38,550 they're not right, they they're really good at tick tock and 403 00:24:38,550 --> 00:24:42,480 Instagram and Snapchat, not not so great at other parts of 404 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:43,710 navigating technology. 405 00:24:46,380 --> 00:24:47,790 Maybe we should put the book on Tiktok. 406 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:54,560 Ah, I mean this is as far as it's coming out of court, 407 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,050 because I haven't implemented it yet. But I know about the 408 00:24:57,050 --> 00:25:00,440 project. And even our current students are using the, they're 409 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:03,320 kind of the last cohort using the text that they purchase, but 410 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:07,370 they seem to be very supportive of it and wish that they had 411 00:25:07,460 --> 00:25:10,940 opportunity. But I will say that, you know, since especially 412 00:25:10,940 --> 00:25:13,910 since the pandemic, each of us in the music theory program have 413 00:25:13,910 --> 00:25:16,970 created some additional content in addition to the book, when we 414 00:25:16,970 --> 00:25:20,150 couldn't teach in person. So I've created video tutorials, 415 00:25:20,150 --> 00:25:24,440 for example, and certain sort of exercises, these exercises. And 416 00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:26,420 that's the kind of stuff that we're going to integrate into 417 00:25:26,420 --> 00:25:28,640 the new books, but those we've been integrating into our 418 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:31,700 classes for the last four semesters, and they seem to get 419 00:25:32,090 --> 00:25:34,850 very good response for the students. So we're, we're 420 00:25:34,850 --> 00:25:37,070 optimistic that the material we've created so far that we're 421 00:25:37,070 --> 00:25:40,010 integrating into the new book shouldn't be affected. 422 00:25:41,130 --> 00:25:45,780 Yeah. How do you include your open textbook projects in your 423 00:25:45,780 --> 00:25:48,630 own materials for promotion, tenure and evaluation. 424 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,830 So I'm going to turn this I am not on a tenure track. 425 00:25:53,910 --> 00:25:58,260 Instructor line. So other than just recording it in my FAR, 426 00:25:58,260 --> 00:25:59,070 which is now 427 00:26:00,270 --> 00:26:01,200 I don't do a whole lot. 428 00:26:03,220 --> 00:26:06,220 I should have asked my other team members on that. So three 429 00:26:06,220 --> 00:26:09,670 of us are tenured, but one if not, but I know the non tenured, 430 00:26:10,120 --> 00:26:13,210 sir. He puts it in his scholarship, creative activity. 431 00:26:13,540 --> 00:26:16,780 The both the act of winning the award was a peer reviewed 432 00:26:16,780 --> 00:26:22,060 application to get this grant. And, and work on this textbook. 433 00:26:22,420 --> 00:26:25,990 To me, I put it really I think of it as service, where it's 434 00:26:25,990 --> 00:26:30,730 equity, equity and inclusion, especially for the reasons that 435 00:26:30,730 --> 00:26:34,300 I just said, to me, it's about the it's not just developing 436 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:39,700 material, but it's about showing the effort that's being made to 437 00:26:40,030 --> 00:26:42,520 revise your curriculum in those directions. 438 00:26:43,740 --> 00:26:47,430 I'll add here there are some resources and toolkits for 439 00:26:47,430 --> 00:26:50,610 faculty who want to figure out how would I say this in a 440 00:26:50,610 --> 00:26:54,570 narrative? How would I reflect to this then my materials for 441 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:57,600 for annual evaluation or for promotion and tenure? So there 442 00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:01,380 are certainly some guides that provide support for that. 443 00:27:02,830 --> 00:27:04,420 What's next for your open textbook? 444 00:27:05,830 --> 00:27:09,100 We're going to try to make it smaller? We're gonna try to 445 00:27:09,100 --> 00:27:12,610 decrease the size of that. I'm very interested in using the 446 00:27:12,610 --> 00:27:16,210 manifold. And being able to I would love to do some of the 447 00:27:16,210 --> 00:27:19,870 things that you were talking about shown sample speeches, in 448 00:27:19,870 --> 00:27:21,910 sample clips, like for talking about interpersonal 449 00:27:21,910 --> 00:27:25,870 communication, there are lots of media clips out there from that 450 00:27:25,870 --> 00:27:29,170 are open access for movies, and television shows, Netflix 451 00:27:29,170 --> 00:27:32,860 series, or whatever it happens to be. So that that would that 452 00:27:32,860 --> 00:27:38,290 is definitely within my sight. And having, yes, I think one 453 00:27:38,620 --> 00:27:43,780 access point is really good. So shrinking it, taking out the 454 00:27:43,780 --> 00:27:46,570 unnecessary fluff of the textbook, I don't know if that's 455 00:27:46,570 --> 00:27:48,790 the appropriate way to say that. That's what I'm going to say. 456 00:27:49,210 --> 00:27:52,540 And really getting down to sort of those bare bones of concepts 457 00:27:52,540 --> 00:27:56,890 that I want students to know. So that I can then teach that and 458 00:27:56,890 --> 00:28:00,220 deliver the teaching of that, which is such an important part 459 00:28:00,220 --> 00:28:01,390 of who I am. 460 00:28:04,350 --> 00:28:07,350 Well, I mean, we're just finishing up our textbook for 461 00:28:07,710 --> 00:28:11,100 December deadline to get it done. So, but it first class 462 00:28:11,100 --> 00:28:14,010 that's going to use this book will be in the spring, the kind 463 00:28:14,010 --> 00:28:14,160 of 464 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:19,500 pilot 465 00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:23,560 pilots and the pilot did in the spring, we have, of course, 466 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:26,590 semester sequence, but there's a one semester, a single class 467 00:28:26,590 --> 00:28:30,160 that's offset by semester. So that starts this spring with the 468 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:32,830 first semester sequence. So it'd be nice to offset it with that 469 00:28:32,830 --> 00:28:35,740 one smaller cohort. And then beginning next fall, really the 470 00:28:35,740 --> 00:28:38,890 big new incoming cohort, students will use materials, so 471 00:28:38,890 --> 00:28:42,790 be able to edit it and tweak it for them. And also our our 472 00:28:42,790 --> 00:28:45,640 grants, as you know, was, unfortunately, I mean, we got 473 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:47,230 the grant, which we're very thankful for, but it was cut 474 00:28:47,230 --> 00:28:50,290 back a little bit. So we had to reduce our scope for only two 475 00:28:50,290 --> 00:28:54,400 semesters. So what we needed to hopefully get some support to to 476 00:28:54,850 --> 00:28:57,370 leave for the next two semesters for the first semesters three 477 00:28:57,370 --> 00:28:59,080 and four. That's kind of our next 478 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:02,550 I'll mention one of 479 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:07,220 the other teams on campus that was awarded a grant with the 480 00:29:07,220 --> 00:29:12,260 Regents OER grant program is currently working on a textbook 481 00:29:12,470 --> 00:29:17,000 theme December deadline for the oral communication course. So 482 00:29:17,000 --> 00:29:19,820 that content will be openly licensed as well. And so for 483 00:29:19,820 --> 00:29:24,770 Cornerstone which teaches oral communication in addition to 484 00:29:25,250 --> 00:29:29,420 academic writing, that can be content that then they can use 485 00:29:29,510 --> 00:29:34,610 and incorporate into their texts if they so choose. Laden. So it 486 00:29:34,610 --> 00:29:40,280 all comes full circle. Um, I wanted to mention these that 487 00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:44,570 you've heard about our two of five UNI published open 488 00:29:44,570 --> 00:29:48,590 textbooks that will come out during the current academic 489 00:29:48,590 --> 00:29:52,490 year. So you see some of the others there, the estimated cost 490 00:29:52,490 --> 00:29:59,030 savings to UNI students will be about $300,000 per year. So and 491 00:29:59,030 --> 00:30:04,190 then we're just getting ready to announce some new recipients of 492 00:30:04,430 --> 00:30:07,400 the UNI textbook equity mini grant, which is the first time 493 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,000 that we thought internal university funds dedicated to 494 00:30:11,930 --> 00:30:15,710 textbook equity projects for faculty. So those should be 495 00:30:15,710 --> 00:30:18,140 announced by the end of the month. So we'll have even more. 496 00:30:18,500 --> 00:30:21,920 And this is in addition to faculty who are using existing 497 00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:26,870 open license resources, typically those faculty number 498 00:30:26,870 --> 00:30:31,640 about 15 to 20 per year and save students somewhere in the in the 499 00:30:31,670 --> 00:30:37,190 range of 200 to $300,000 per year. So collectively, we have 500 00:30:37,190 --> 00:30:40,880 saved UNI students since we started tracking, a million 501 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:45,350 dollars. And that's just in the ones we know about. We think 502 00:30:45,350 --> 00:30:49,310 there are faculty who are using free things that haven't 503 00:30:49,310 --> 00:30:52,670 necessarily always reported those to us. And so these 504 00:30:52,670 --> 00:30:55,130 projects that you've heard about today are sort of part of that 505 00:30:55,130 --> 00:31:00,740 bigger, bigger ecosystem. I'd like to turn it over to 506 00:31:00,740 --> 00:31:03,830 questions from the audience. As I do that I have a few resources 507 00:31:03,830 --> 00:31:07,400 up here that might be useful. And the first one is linked on 508 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,370 the URL is included on the handout here. So if you want to 509 00:31:10,370 --> 00:31:13,730 take that that might be useful. It's a guide about all things 510 00:31:13,730 --> 00:31:16,340 textbook equity, so some additional statistics and 511 00:31:16,340 --> 00:31:21,140 resources and support. For faculty interested in using 512 00:31:21,170 --> 00:31:24,950 existing, free and affordable resources, maybe they're not 513 00:31:24,950 --> 00:31:28,100 going to be quite so brave as these folks to create their own. 514 00:31:28,850 --> 00:31:32,120 But they maybe want to see are there some free and affordable 515 00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,120 resources for their course, we offer a course materials 516 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:39,350 affordability review, a very short form where faculty fill 517 00:31:39,350 --> 00:31:41,780 out their name, little bit of information about the course and 518 00:31:41,780 --> 00:31:44,930 upload their syllabus, as simple as that. And then we provide a 519 00:31:44,930 --> 00:31:48,080 customized list of free and affordable materials that match 520 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:52,160 their course. So we can help identify those things to see the 521 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:56,660 type of faculty so that is available there. And then we're 522 00:31:56,660 --> 00:32:01,160 also happy to meet with individual faculty present at 523 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,010 departments. If we want to kind of think about this 524 00:32:04,010 --> 00:32:06,860 programmatically, that we can really kind of push those 525 00:32:06,860 --> 00:32:09,740 conversations forward. So I wanted to mention those things. 526 00:32:10,130 --> 00:32:14,660 And now I'd love to open it up to questions for our panelists 527 00:32:14,660 --> 00:32:18,020 are about a textbook book equity more generally, we have about 10 528 00:32:18,020 --> 00:32:20,960 minutes left. So plenty of time for your questions. 529 00:32:23,420 --> 00:32:27,140 Guys, it is a two part question. So you decide who's going to 530 00:32:27,140 --> 00:32:35,390 answer it. We've talked about open the publishing date, per 531 00:32:35,390 --> 00:32:41,270 se, when it's ready to go open up online. But what have you let 532 00:32:41,300 --> 00:32:49,070 us know? How can or when does the book editable where you can 533 00:32:49,070 --> 00:32:54,080 go in and make changes and do different types of editing that 534 00:32:54,080 --> 00:32:58,880 need to be done, per se, revising it. The second part of 535 00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:03,080 the question is it would apply to I guess both of you that 536 00:33:03,110 --> 00:33:08,630 within the music area. You may comment this would be on the 537 00:33:08,630 --> 00:33:15,560 lines of furthering furthering the learning engagement. That 538 00:33:16,100 --> 00:33:22,010 would either of you be interested in allowing a student 539 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:27,170 or students as you're teaching these classes with these books, 540 00:33:27,650 --> 00:33:33,140 allow them to be part of the next publication, per se, in the 541 00:33:33,140 --> 00:33:38,840 music. Maybe you're explaining how to do this type of music 542 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:42,380 performance. And then you would tell the students, oh, yes, 543 00:33:42,890 --> 00:33:45,530 we've got this you can be published, you'll be in this 544 00:33:45,530 --> 00:33:49,760 book, blah, blah, blah. And then we would have a recording of the 545 00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:55,040 students that would further their investment in the academia 546 00:33:55,070 --> 00:34:00,140 online, where and you Anne Marie did a great job on the cover. 547 00:34:00,350 --> 00:34:04,010 You never know in four years, though, you have a couple of 548 00:34:04,010 --> 00:34:08,330 graphic nature. So we're marketing. So those are my two 549 00:34:08,330 --> 00:34:11,990 questions. I'd say yeah. 550 00:34:14,330 --> 00:34:19,340 So revising. Anne Marie takes care of a lot of that for us. 551 00:34:20,240 --> 00:34:22,730 But I think it's one of the things it's funny that you asked 552 00:34:22,730 --> 00:34:25,220 that because I was actually thinking right before she asked 553 00:34:25,220 --> 00:34:28,100 for questions. That's something I didn't touch on, that I love 554 00:34:28,100 --> 00:34:32,390 about the OER because textbooks as as any faculty member knows, 555 00:34:32,450 --> 00:34:36,110 goes out of date within you know, often before we even get 556 00:34:36,110 --> 00:34:41,270 it and certainly teaching in common media. Our media changes 557 00:34:41,270 --> 00:34:45,260 so frequently and so quickly, you know, what is popular and 558 00:34:45,260 --> 00:34:50,870 and how to do those things. That I love the idea of revising 559 00:34:50,900 --> 00:34:54,230 after every academic year, right and going back through and 560 00:34:54,230 --> 00:34:57,350 saying okay, what, what is no longer you know, we can't have 561 00:34:57,350 --> 00:34:59,810 any Friends clips anymore. You know, our students think they 562 00:34:59,810 --> 00:35:02,540 want watch friends, but Friends is is problematic in a variety 563 00:35:02,540 --> 00:35:05,720 of ways. But they no longer watch The Office, they have no 564 00:35:05,720 --> 00:35:09,980 idea what The Office was right? So, so books that now reference 565 00:35:10,010 --> 00:35:13,730 that in group communication, students don't understand those 566 00:35:13,730 --> 00:35:18,830 references. So or their ability to go in, like I said, after 567 00:35:18,830 --> 00:35:22,820 every academic year, and really kind of hunker down with it and 568 00:35:22,820 --> 00:35:25,550 say, Okay, what are things that are now outdated, throw them 569 00:35:25,550 --> 00:35:28,910 out. And then I would love the idea of bringing a student in to 570 00:35:28,910 --> 00:35:32,000 say, hey, what's a great updated example of this? Because they're 571 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:36,320 the best ones to ask, right? So I guess I touched on seconds. 572 00:35:39,210 --> 00:35:43,800 Student Involvement you bring up, it's really interesting. And 573 00:35:43,980 --> 00:35:46,230 it connects with something I've thought about kind of another in 574 00:35:46,230 --> 00:35:50,580 other domains, student involvement, building, and a 575 00:35:50,580 --> 00:35:55,140 deep integrated sort of online presence of student musical 576 00:35:55,140 --> 00:35:57,630 cohorts over the years. But I thought about music theory, 577 00:35:58,620 --> 00:36:01,080 thinking is something that we should explore. I mean, off the 578 00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:03,990 top of my head, I can imagine a project, maybe an assignment 579 00:36:03,990 --> 00:36:07,320 where students have to pick one of the topics and make a video 580 00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:10,380 make an audio recording, where they explain maybe in repertoire 581 00:36:10,380 --> 00:36:13,260 they're playing, singing at that certain time with your applied 582 00:36:13,260 --> 00:36:16,020 professors. Oh, here's an example of this core, here is an 583 00:36:16,020 --> 00:36:18,750 example of this concept. And they can explain it their own 584 00:36:18,750 --> 00:36:22,020 language, their own words, and putting those videos kind of as 585 00:36:22,050 --> 00:36:25,650 media clips, off the top of my head that comes to mind, I think 586 00:36:25,650 --> 00:36:28,920 it's something we haven't explored. We will in the future. 587 00:36:29,670 --> 00:36:33,150 And it sounds like we're, we're able to edit it ongoingly. I 588 00:36:33,150 --> 00:36:37,350 mean, we can't kind of do it all the time. But But I imagine 589 00:36:37,350 --> 00:36:40,410 every semester we're gonna have some revisions update. 590 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:45,850 So sometimes these are sort of small, continual updates, but 591 00:36:45,850 --> 00:36:48,370 there will be cases where, okay, we're going to do the next 592 00:36:48,370 --> 00:36:51,820 edition. And some of our authors are already talking about that. 593 00:36:51,820 --> 00:36:57,310 So the textbook in Spanish that Gabby Oliveira's is co author on 594 00:36:57,310 --> 00:36:59,950 was the books from University of Iowa. And yes, it's called, 595 00:37:00,460 --> 00:37:04,030 they're already talking about, okay, second one, what are we 596 00:37:04,030 --> 00:37:06,700 doing next? Right, so they're moving forward with other 597 00:37:06,700 --> 00:37:10,000 projects. But that sort of, you know, the new edition or the 598 00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:13,780 volume two, those are, those are things that our faculty are 599 00:37:13,780 --> 00:37:18,880 certainly thinking about the student involvement piece, if 600 00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,810 you missed Jonathan's session on open pedagogy, we'll look for 601 00:37:22,810 --> 00:37:27,490 the recording because I think those those exciting 602 00:37:27,490 --> 00:37:31,990 opportunities to help students feel invested in what they're 603 00:37:31,990 --> 00:37:34,840 learning demonstrate what they're learning through 604 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:37,240 something like a renewable assignment, where it's not just 605 00:37:37,240 --> 00:37:40,750 something my professor sees or hears, it's something that has a 606 00:37:40,750 --> 00:37:43,840 wider audience that is now part of sort of the canon of the 607 00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:49,150 course. Can I use that term? I think that's an important sort 608 00:37:49,150 --> 00:37:53,410 of consideration. When we're thinking about the way that 609 00:37:53,410 --> 00:37:55,930 students interact with our course materials. Maybe they're 610 00:37:55,930 --> 00:37:59,320 the ones creating the course materials in some contexts. So 611 00:37:59,950 --> 00:38:04,060 yeah, open pedagogy. That's a good example of that. Other 612 00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:08,620 Have questions? So with, you know, the two different 613 00:38:04,060 --> 00:38:04,810 questions? 614 00:38:08,620 --> 00:38:12,280 textbooks, one was, one was going through the grant process? 615 00:38:12,430 --> 00:38:18,070 The other one was not. But once you get done, are both of them 616 00:38:18,070 --> 00:38:23,860 have creative common licenses assigned to them, I'm asking, Is 617 00:38:23,860 --> 00:38:24,550 that true? 618 00:38:25,410 --> 00:38:28,470 As for the grant that was required, so the authors could 619 00:38:28,470 --> 00:38:32,010 select one of the Creative Commons license options, the 620 00:38:32,010 --> 00:38:35,190 only one that was off the table was the no derivatives, because 621 00:38:35,190 --> 00:38:39,510 we want the work to be able to be modified by others. So that 622 00:38:39,510 --> 00:38:43,470 was the requirement. For the Cornerstone text, it really 623 00:38:43,470 --> 00:38:47,610 depended on the original source material, several of them were 624 00:38:47,610 --> 00:38:51,930 had a Share Alike element to the Creative Commons license, which 625 00:38:51,930 --> 00:38:54,930 means that any modification, we need to share under a similar 626 00:38:54,930 --> 00:38:58,890 license, so that really dictated that with seven different openly 627 00:38:58,890 --> 00:39:03,690 licensed textbooks that we were kind of doing a remix of. It was 628 00:39:03,690 --> 00:39:07,320 my first opportunity to get practice with, okay, which is, 629 00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:12,360 which license, you know, we're having to really dig into what 630 00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:14,910 are the restrictions? What can we do? There were a couple of 631 00:39:14,910 --> 00:39:19,290 things that were no derivatives that we did use, and so we can 632 00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:23,160 share them, but we can modify them. And so we had to be really 633 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:24,180 careful about that. 634 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:27,690 So the different sections have different licenses? Yes. 635 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:31,200 And actually, some of the images on the cover are all rights 636 00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:33,540 reserved copyright, because they're from University 637 00:39:33,540 --> 00:39:37,320 Relations, and I sought permission to include them. Some 638 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:40,770 of the images I took, and I openly license those and so even 639 00:39:40,770 --> 00:39:46,380 on the cover alone, there's a mix of usage rights. And I took 640 00:39:46,380 --> 00:39:51,210 care of all that gobbledygook. We have a lot of spreadsheets, a 641 00:39:51,240 --> 00:39:52,590 lot of spreadsheets. 642 00:39:53,910 --> 00:39:54,480 Other questions, 643 00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:58,890 How does the revision process work on these various platforms? 644 00:39:59,130 --> 00:40:02,130 I mean, it's like a Google Doc. So if I go in and tweak 645 00:40:02,130 --> 00:40:06,450 something today, can anybody downloading it? Subsequently, 646 00:40:06,450 --> 00:40:09,780 we'll see that reflected. Are there periods that where it's 647 00:40:09,780 --> 00:40:14,310 opened up? Does it have to be named as a new edition? At some 648 00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:21,500 The answer is it depends. So we're primarily using going to 649 00:40:14,310 --> 00:40:14,730 point? 650 00:40:21,500 --> 00:40:28,130 be using manifold for our open authoring software. And it's 651 00:40:28,130 --> 00:40:33,080 currently not a WYSIWYG editor. So it's not alive like instant 652 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:36,230 and make a change, it's already reflected for the public, you 653 00:40:36,230 --> 00:40:38,930 actually make changes to the source material, which might be 654 00:40:38,930 --> 00:40:42,740 in Microsoft Word might be in Google Docs that can kind of 655 00:40:42,860 --> 00:40:47,570 ingest a variety of formats. But you would make changes to that 656 00:40:47,570 --> 00:40:50,510 source material and then essentially re upload it. 657 00:40:52,340 --> 00:40:55,670 Versioning history with the OER is probably a conversation we 658 00:40:55,670 --> 00:41:00,650 don't have time for right now. Small changes, like you know, 659 00:41:00,650 --> 00:41:03,230 fixing a typo or something like that. We've already done that 660 00:41:03,230 --> 00:41:07,340 multiple times, or when, when Deb said we forgot an entire 661 00:41:07,340 --> 00:41:11,990 chapter. And I quickly added to this, and I almost said 662 00:41:11,990 --> 00:41:15,050 something when I realized that piece was missing. I didn't 663 00:41:15,050 --> 00:41:18,680 question it, may well hold powder. So we were able to kind 664 00:41:18,680 --> 00:41:21,950 of quickly do that we considered it all that, those small 665 00:41:21,950 --> 00:41:28,400 changes, all one edition. And then if we're going to make sort 666 00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:33,530 of more major changes are like for next academic year, that no 667 00:41:33,530 --> 00:41:37,430 promises, we'll see what happens this summer, then we would do a 668 00:41:37,430 --> 00:41:40,580 sort of volume two, or edition two. 669 00:41:41,610 --> 00:41:45,690 let's say, a student said, I've discovered this stale blank on 670 00:41:45,690 --> 00:41:49,770 this page, and you go and you find it needs to be updated, you 671 00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:53,700 make that update, can you then tell the class, I've made the 672 00:41:53,700 --> 00:41:55,620 change, and does anyone 673 00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:59,890 we could do that way it's can do that a variety of ways. But I 674 00:41:59,890 --> 00:42:02,320 think when Nikki was talking about the different pathways, 675 00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:04,630 there were almost too many ways for the students to get to the 676 00:42:04,630 --> 00:42:09,280 content. If we're using an e book authoring software, which 677 00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:12,340 we have temporarily free that we'll have to decide as 678 00:42:12,340 --> 00:42:15,910 university if we're able to emulate the pay for after spring 679 00:42:15,940 --> 00:42:20,230 2024, we could make that change. And it would be reflected in all 680 00:42:20,230 --> 00:42:25,030 those versions of it in one place, rather than in multiple 681 00:42:25,030 --> 00:42:29,350 versions of versioning gets complicated, but I'll take care 682 00:42:29,350 --> 00:42:30,310 of that on the back end. 683 00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:33,730 I'm just thinking about the implications of that. If 684 00:42:33,730 --> 00:42:38,110 somebody I mean, people don't quote textbooks, too much. And 685 00:42:38,110 --> 00:42:40,390 it's going to have to be like quoting the website, you have to 686 00:42:40,390 --> 00:42:45,490 put the access date along with it or something. Yeah, so the 687 00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:50,680 there's the question, do earlier editions get archived anymore, 688 00:42:50,710 --> 00:42:52,030 should they be they should be? 689 00:42:52,080 --> 00:42:55,950 Yeah, we already archive them. And UNI ScholarWorks. And we'll 690 00:42:55,950 --> 00:43:01,950 continue to do that for subsequent editions. And with 691 00:43:02,410 --> 00:43:06,760 regular published books within ScholarWorks, we have a faculty 692 00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:10,450 Book Gallery with mainly metadata information, and then 693 00:43:10,450 --> 00:43:14,650 link to Amazon and stuff like that. And we have multiple 694 00:43:14,740 --> 00:43:21,700 editions of different books. But also, we do have a few full open 695 00:43:21,790 --> 00:43:27,040 access books that the author, or you know, has full copyright and 696 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:31,780 they're fully in ScholarWorks. And so then 10 would be if there 697 00:43:31,780 --> 00:43:35,980 is a second edition of any of these books that we would put 698 00:43:35,980 --> 00:43:39,310 the full second edition or our private [inaudible]. 699 00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:43,810 We have a nice workflow at process thanks to Ellen. 700 00:43:44,860 --> 00:43:49,120 And with the grant books, and maybe with the manifold, we 701 00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:55,300 could then link and we already have the capability turned on to 702 00:43:55,300 --> 00:43:58,780 whatever the platform, the WordPress platform once the book 703 00:43:58,780 --> 00:44:03,310 is done. So within the ScholarWorks record, there would 704 00:44:03,310 --> 00:44:10,360 be the PDF of you know, so it's archived forever, but then also 705 00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:15,280 a link to the active book, in whatever software. 706 00:44:17,710 --> 00:44:21,280 That's all the time we have. We can stick around a little bit if 707 00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:25,210 there are some other questions, but we invite you to come to the 708 00:44:25,210 --> 00:44:28,510 sessions tomorrow and then following the sessions tomorrow 709 00:44:28,510 --> 00:44:32,230 there are there's a reception. Again, there's a handout back 710 00:44:32,230 --> 00:44:35,080 there, and you can sign up for the textbook equity group group 711 00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:37,510 if you're interested in that, my card is up there, so if there's 712 00:44:37,510 --> 00:44:39,130 some questions they want to follow up with 713 00:44:39,210 --> 00:44:42,656 later. So one thing that I wanted to add before we go I 714 00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:46,542 just wanted to give a big shout out to Deb Young in Languages 715 00:44:46,604 --> 00:44:50,615 and Literatures who created who helped we created this together. 716 00:44:50,678 --> 00:44:54,563 She is an adjunct professor for eons here, so she does not get 717 00:44:54,626 --> 00:44:58,574 paid through the summer. She did not get paid to do any of this 718 00:44:58,637 --> 00:45:02,585 work. And I am so humbled by her understanding of equity issues 719 00:45:02,648 --> 00:45:06,471 and financial issues that she really thought it was important 720 00:45:06,533 --> 00:45:10,481 to take her own time and and do this for for the benefit of our 721 00:45:10,544 --> 00:45:14,430 students. So I just really want to recognize her in that work. 722 00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:19,490 An important note to acknowledge Well, thank you so much.